Agenda item

The Chair confirmed for the Committee that this agenda item would be number 8 and that the agenda item “Call in the Chief Education Officer re the Internal Audit of School Trips and Visits resulting in a second Unsatisfactory Opinion” would now be item number 7.

The Chair reiterated that the Committee had been advised that this agenda item be deferred to the next Committee meeting in October as September was a busy time for schools. An invitation had been sent to the Chair of Governors and the Headteacher of Caerleon School but an extension had been requested by those parties to defer further to November’s Committee. 

The Chair expressed disappointment that the invited parties were not present as both parties needed to be at the Committee. It was commented that the Chair did not find this acceptable.

The Chair suggested for the agenda item to be postponed to November’s Committee and if the Chair of Governors and the Headteacher were not present, the Committee would proceed without those parties present.

The Chair commented that the Audit took place in December 2018 and it was months before the present Committee taking place and if parties disagreed with the report then they needed to discuss the material in the report.

A Member stated that they were not satisfied with the parties not being present at the Committee and wanted this challenged.

The Chief Internal Auditor commented that they were aware that some of the issues were being addressed and that the Headteacher had disagreed with some of the concerns raised in the Internal Audit report. The final report was submitted last week and this contained management comments from the Headteacher. It was not known whether recommendations had been actioned at this stage; this will be checked when the Internal Audit team undertake a follow up audit within 6 to 12 months of the final report being issued.

A Member asked whether the school were in the process of discussing the issues with Finance.

The Head of Finance confirmed that a lot of work was completed with all schools in relation to their budgets as well as Caerleon School. They also confirmed that the situation was not resolved but conversations were ongoing and the Council took a firm view. Actions had been suggested to the school which would be considered by the Headteacher and when Finance consulted with the Headteacher at their next meeting, it would be confirmed at that time.

A Member questioned whether this non-attendance was an attempt to stall as there were concerns regarding the figures, in terms of the projected £1 million deficit as it needed to be brought down as it was concerning.

The Chair agreed with this statement and stated that wider questions needed to be asked but this was not appropriate for this meeting. The Chair also stated that if the invited parties did not attend November’s meeting, the Chief Executive would be notified of this absence. 

It was confirmed that the figures would be revised soon, and the Chair requested for the Head of Finance to provide a verbal update to the Committee on the latest position at a future Committee.

It was commented that the Committee required written answers in relation to whether the issues highlighted had been addressed by the school as the Committee could possibly be discussing issues that may have been addressed. It was confirmed by the Chair that a written response would be requested from the Headteacher.

It was discussed by the Committee that there were other issues in the Audit report that were concerning not just the financial issues which were also worrying as there were concerns regarding possible negligence. 

The Head of Finance confirmed that all issues needed to be looked at as the deficit was worrying as well as the basic day to day issues and a balanced conversation was needed.

It was questioned by a Member that issues like this should possibly be on the Corporate Risk Register.

The Chief Internal Auditor confirmed that the report presented to Audit Committee was a summary of key weaknesses identified during the audit of the School; and it was suggested that the Audit Committee could receive a presentation from the Chief Internal Auditor in future of how Internal Audit reports are compiled and how the overall opinion is arrived at taking into account strengths and weaknesses.

It was stated that item 3:10 in the Moderate table had been previously in the Significant table in previous versions of the Internal Audit report and this reflected work that was done. The risk was reassessed after consulting with the Headteacher.  

Agreed:

• For the agenda item to be deferred to the Audit Committee on the 21 November 2019. 

• For the Governance Support Officer to send a letter to the Headteacher of Caerleon School requesting a written response in relation to the audit report presented to the Audit Committee.

• The Head of Finance to provide a verbal update on financial progress.